Kevin ums (he loses it with Red Kerry!)

KEVIN RUDD: Well, um, as I said before, Kerry, um, some of the large mining companies and some other companies are going to say all sorts of things as we sort out, um, the detail of this. But, um, again, it reminds me of a campaign which was run against the Labor Party in the lead up to the last federal election about how the abolition of Work Choices would fundamentally destroy the mining industry as well.

Well that hasn't happened, um, nor did the introduction of the petroleum resource rent tax 25 years ago. So we've got to deal with these things on their merits.

Linky here, um.

Oh, mate this is too good.

KERRY O’BRIEN: I'll get to the Budget details shortly but can you clear up a puzzle for me first. You've...

KEVIN RUDD: I'll try mate

KERRY O'BRIEN: ...you've spent the best part of two years building up your political capital. How have you managed to damage brand Rudd so comprehensively in such a short time this year?

KEVIN RUDD: Kerry, obviously the Government's going through a tough time at present. I've said as much to colleagues in the caucus. Governments from time to time go through difficult periods like this.

Look, our job is to, is to get on with the business of governing the country. There are lots of challenges we've handled well in the past, there's few things that we've got wrong, but when I go to the future and the proposition we've gotta put to the Australian people is: who's most competent and capable of managing this economy in very difficult global times?

So, some of those...

KERRY O’BRIEN: You, I, I said brand Rudd, you said the Government. I'm talking about Kevin Rudd, I'm talking about your image, your credibility, your brand.

Whether some of those that appear to have been lost to you this year come back before the next election, or not, do you understand why so many people have turned against you now, Kevin Rudd, not just the Government, Kevin Rudd, and do you accept that they have judged your leadership and found you wanting?

KEVIN RUDD: Kerry, that is a question which, um, you should, um, put to other folk who are political commentators and the rest. My job is to get on with the business of …

KERRY O’BRIEN: No, I'm putting it to you...

KEVIN RUDD: ...no, no...

KERRY O'BRIEN: ...because you can't possibly suggest that this does not exercise your mind at all, that you are so focused, you're so focused on Government that you're not concerned about whether you're losing support going into the next election?

KEVIN RUDD: Kerry, look I'm human like anyone else and of course you'd, um. be, um, um, be inhuman if you weren't affected by developments from time to time, that's just the truth of it.

As I said before, we've been going through a tough time. Obviously a whole lot of people in the community have been disappointed by the position I announced in relation to the future of the Carbon Pollution Reduction Scheme.

What's the reality that I had to confront there? Well two realities. One is that the Liberal Party backflipped and voted our legislation down, having negotiated an agreement with Mr Turnbull to get it through. That is the reality we had to confront and the second reality is this, that when we got to Copenhagen it didn't produce the sort of progress and the global agenda that we all had hoped, therefore where do we go to from here?

Our commitment on climate change hasn't changed one bit, it's happening...

KERRY O'BRIEN: but um...

KEVIN RUDD: No, hang on, let me finish, you've asked me a pretty fundamental question here which is about how the actions which I'm responsible for and the Government's responsible for are being seen.

On the question of climate change our view hasn't changed one bit. The greenhouse gas reduction targets remain the same, our commitment to a Carbon Pollution Reduction Scheme is the best way of getting there is the same, but we can't alter the fact the Liberal Party hasn't voted this down in the Senate...

KERRY O'BRIEN: OK, but...

KEVIN RUDD: ...therefore we have to...

KERRY O’BRIEN: ...but there's one thing you can't escape and that is this: it is still in your hands to go to the next election on the issue as you defined as ‘a great moral challenge of our time’, an issue on which you accused the Opposition of political, of absolute political cowardice, it's in your hands to go to the next election, seek a double dissolution, whether you seek a double dissolution or not and make this ETS (Emissions Trading Scheme) a fresh mandate for the people to decide and tell both sides of politics what they want.

Now you have squibbed that decision. You have put this on the backburner until 2013, at least, in the Budget makes that clear?

KEVIN RUDD: You know, something, Kerry, I will be delighted to fight Mr Abbott on the next election, at the next election, whenever it is held, on climate change absolutely...

KERRY O’BRIEN: On the ETS?